These 2 posts from Offstumped on CNN-IBN’s opinion poll for the upcoming Karnataka Assembly elections have generated quite a bit of debate.
So how does the world conduct opinion poll, some Offstumped Research to put this into perspective.
First Gallup which has this excellent summary extract from a Book on how it conducts polls.
The current U.S. adult population in the continental United States is 187 million. The typical sample size for a Gallup poll, which is designed to represent this general population, is 1,000 national adults. The actual number of people that need to be interviewed for a given sample is to some degree less important than the soundness of the fundamental equal probability of selection principle. In other words — although this is something many people find hard to believe if respondents are not selected randomly, we could have a poll with a million people and still be significantly less likely to represent the views of all Americans than a much smaller sample of just 1,000 people — that sample is selected randomly.
So if we go by Gallup which has the most experience, the litmus test for CNN-IBN is how good its selection technique in ensuring equal probability.
Next the Pew Center which also has a good track record in Polls in the United States. Its methodology has an interesting comment on the bias introduced by non-responses.
Non-response in telephone interview surveys produces some known biases in survey-derived estimates because participation tends to vary for different subgroups of the population, and these subgroups are likely to vary also on questions of substantive interest. In order to compensate for these known biases, the sample data are weighted in analysis.
The demographic weighting parameters are derived from a special analysis of the most recently available Census Bureau?s Current Population Survey (March 2005). This analysis produces population parameters for the demographic characteristics of households with adults 18 years of age or older, which are then compared with the sample characteristics to construct sample weights. The analysis only includes households in the continental United States that contain a telephone. The weights are derived using an iterative technique that simultaneously balances the distributions of all weighting parameters.
This reinforces Offstumped’s argument about the 5124 respondents of the 9000 in CNN-IBN’s sample likely having introduced a bias in its findings.
Another international pollster John Zogby has this to say on biases in sampling
If I draw 1000 out at random, chances are I will get the same numbers of each 95 times out of 100 within a margin of error of +/-3%. However, there are other sources of survey error – e.g. how questions are phrased, etc…..
we apply weighting for party identification to ensure that there is no built-in Democratic bias in our sampling
Next up is Scott Rasmussen who was the only one to project both Bush and Kerry’s vote total within half a percentage point of the actual outcome during the 2004 U.S. Presidential election with this comment on the polling during the 2004 election
As always, it’s useful to use common sense when reviewing poll data. If a poll suggests that 10 or 20 percent of Americans are changing their mind on a regular basis, it should be viewed with caution. Most of the time, you will find that the partisan mix of the polling sample is changing more than the actual perceptions of voters.
Once again a question of what was the partisan mix in the CNN-IBN sample of 5124.
Finally the mother of them all, Real Clear Politics which averages all the polls tracking the current U.S. Presidential elections?for the 2008 race between Barak Obama, Hillary Clinton and John McCain has an interesting chart on the sample sizes and the spread across polls.
Offstumped Bottomline: The world over there is a lot more rigor in demographic profiling to account for biases and there is a lot more polling to accurately prognosticate. CNN-IBN has much explaining it do on how its sampling is free of bias. But before that does it even know what partisan and demographic biases exist beyond the obvious on religion and caste.
Filed under: Karnataka Polls 2008
Why will BJP win in Karnataka, and eventually the national election with a thumping majority despite the media spin ?
First of all, the electorate of India have seen through the incompetent, impotent, non-functional UPA rule. Proof ? the string of elections that Congress has lost despite populist measures.
Secondly, and more importantly, Sardesai and Yogendra Yadav cant spin the price of rice. They cannot spin 7.57% inflation. They cant spin 3 year high prices. They can try, but it aint going to work. If there is one electoral ally that BJP can rely upon to definitely deliver without any ‘coalition drama’ later, it’s inflation.
Indian prices at three year high
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7379947.stm
India inflation hits 42-month-high of 7.57 pct
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5helt_k-L5_OhLg2jm1BGDQrV93Lg
It’s a sad day in India that people are finding it difficult to afford food, but it will help bring the people in power that atleast have the right ideas about solving India’s problems.
We have a fifth estate which functions best when non controversial or politically correct issues can be espoused. Probably the media labours from an unwarranted guilt which stops it from articulating uncomfortable questions.
Take for example, reservations. Does the media has the courage to go into the 69% reservation in Tamil Nadu. It is no longer an issue of social justice over merit. Instead we are now seeing the classical reverse discrimination against the so called upper castes. The backwards(?) and the scheduled castes have long caught up with the upper castes and have now gone beyond. More than 95% of the 31% open competition seats are secured by candidates from reserved categories. Does it indicate that we can slowly do away with reservations at least in Tamil Nadu? Remember, the Mandal recommendations have been in vogue in Tamil Nadu since 1980 when MGR introduced them to make up for the unexpected loss in the Lok Sabha elections. Which media house including the so called National Newspaper of India a celebrated (card holding) newspaper has brought this issue? This worthy newspaper will carry a repartee, a denial or an interview of every known left liberal(?) (if there is one) if any wrong thing happens in Bengal in the first page and a diluted version of the happening in the 7th page making the reader read the denial first before going into the details of the incident.
There is a self imposed censorship in reporting about religious fundamentalism (except the Hindu variety), and we can endlessly keep hearing news and view which are woolly at best and irrelevant at worst. Similarly, it is a well known fact that there are a few communities like say the Meenas of Rajasthan for example, who have been cornering the benefits of reservation since their introduction but not a word will be mentioned lest the media be blamed for being anti-progressive.
It is also well known that the so called backwards are the biggest oppressors of the scheduled castes but it is politically incorrect to discuss it. A famous Dalit writer ultimately has found space to vent the inner conflicts of caste only in the Pioneer. Presumably, the progressive media does not have the courage to publish politically incorrect views.
CNN IBN reflects the best and the worst of the new age Media which indulges in self flagellation, is mealy mouthed when occasions demands calling a spade, a spade. There is a lot we need to learn from newspapers like the Washington Post which sets the standards for the highest form of journalism, gives opportunity and space for contrarian views, is not afraid of voicing unpopular views, does not mind swimming against the tide and remains till date an example that should be followed by our media. Early days yet, I presume!
I say BJP is already in power in Karnataka, why coz the people have realized that voting for the Congress or the stupid regional parties dont yield any results.
BJP is the only option for India and Karnataka has realized it, hope the country realizes that and BJP is back in power so that we are secured.
i think its bit too early to predict the poll outcome because its the first state going throught the revised electoral constituencies…..n we need to analyse bit by bit n constituency by constituency…whcih can be done only afetr the candidatures are finalised n withdrawals take place…afetr all we depend on our expert yossarin and team offstumped….to put forth the true ….BOTTOMLINE
Hi yossarin,
I must congratulate you in the way you have written this post,and your willingness to go to depths inside the issue and bring it out.
Post after post on the topic of exit poles, whenever you have got some comments which were not exactly agreeing with what you had said, you have revealed more and more facts to make your point clearer in a very transparent way.
Keep writing.
The impression I gather from shopkeepers, servant maids, cooks, drivers and other such people who are thought to actually vote, is that the BJP is set to sweep southern Karnataka. However, other parts of the state may decide the final outcome, as they traditionally did. One thing everybody agrees on is the claim that Deve Gowda will electorally bite dust, but may yet again emerge as a kingpin if northern part of the state votes Congress (and as a result there is a hung assembly).
My own opinion is that we’re looking at yet another Congress-JD(S) government that will maybe last — surprisingly — two years and then elections again. Bangalore will remain screwed.
Of the three phases
I phase is considered weakest for the BJP because majority of the seats are in old Mysore areas. However there are seats where BJP is really strong in Bangalore City, Mysore, Tumkur as well as Coorg.
If BJP gets 40 plus seats or close to 40 in I phase out of 89 BJP is in good state to form its own government or close to being majority.
Reason is II phase belongs to Coastral Karnataka, Malnad and Central Karnataka where BJP is supposed to do really well.
Similar with phase 3.
BJP is supposed to get 40-45 seats in each phase sufficient to get majority on its own.
Yossarin,
One can do a simple statistical analysis to discover the presence of a persistent bias. Look at say the last n predications made by Mr. Yadav in states where BJP and Congress are the main contenders, compare his prediction with actual results.
I remember reading somewhere that Indian psephologists do not base their results simply on the sample surveys. The sample surveys are interpreted by “political experts” and after these “experts” add their special spice to the mix do they come up with the final estimates.
Hi Yossarin
Check out the two new opinion polls-one prediciting a BJP victory by noted psephologist Narasimha Rao and another one by The Week which predicts a neck-to neck race between Congress and BJP(appears to be more accurate reflection of ground reality)
All these clearly goes to demonstrate that runaway Congress victory predicted by spin twins (“Lohia meets Far Left” psephologist and Padmashri Sardesai) is yet another instance of what Arun Jaitley so beautifully called “Participatory Psephology” . Its increasingly clear that the ideological biases of pollsters and those who fund them play a key role in influencing outcomes.By their own admission’massaging’ of raw data happens prior to translation of % to seats.This is were i feel someone like Yogendra with his unhealthy obsession with caste based configuration loses the plot.Yes caste is an important dimension but not there are several other important often overriding factors at play.
Caveat-Congress might still win in Karanatka.There is only one certainty in Indian electoral politics-Muslims not voting for BJP.i foresee religious minorties consolidating and resorting to enbloc tactical voting(nothing wrong in it as its a legitimate form of political expression)
It was a charade that CNN-IBN indulged in by constructing a new mythical social category called as “Lower Social Bloc” which is apparently swinging the fortunes in favour of Congress
Prasanna…Dosent this mean that it is straight fight between the BJP and the Congress (I)????
I mean JD (S) will be wiped out????
My prediction
BJP- 135-145
congress- 50-60
JDS- 15-20
my pole openio are
BJP 107 -119 seats
Cong I 59-65 seats
JDs 32-35 seats
In my opinion
BJP 90 – 100
Cong 80 – 95
JDS 45 – 55
My opinion
BJP 115-120
Cong 75-80
JD(S)30-40
My opinion
BJP 110-120
Cong 70-75
JD(s) 40-50
Others 10-20
[...] way its his credibility on the line here and we will hold him accountable to a high standard for this is the second time in a row he has attempted to influence the outcome with his [...]
Bjp is the only alternative in India now We have seen NDA govt being led by AB Vajpayee The Inflation was uts low and governance was superb HEMANSHU MISRA GEN SECY YUVA MORCHA BJP HIMACHAL PRADESH
My opinion
BJP-119
INC-71
JD(S)-33
2009 lokasabha my pole opinian bjp-12t014 inc-10to12 and jd(s)-6to8 in this time oldmysoore jd(s) very strong and open acount in bangaloore central also